A sobering reminder of exactly where we are heading is the following quoted writing. The actual writer of this quote is technically unknown. However most beleive it came from the pen of Alexander Tytler.

Here is the truth:

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage."

WAKE UP PEOPLE!

Great quote and sadly coming true

Thanks for that. I'm hoping for the sake of the country that we will be able to change the tides of what is coming.. not likely to happen, though. It kinda seems like we are in the middle of the fall of rome. The enemy is at the gates, and we are quibbling over whether plants have rights and people feeling that they "deserve" more of what someone else has.

we dont live in a democracy we live in a republic

we dont live in a democracy we live in a republic

democratic republic...
ck

thanx for that post boabrotha,
sadly we have thusly regressed (progressed).
ck

now we're either gonna put our kids in harm's way, or find a place to go that's on the rise and blow this popsicle stand while the gettin's good.
not a great position to be in...
i feel your urgency,
ck

now we're either gonna put our kids in harm's way, or find a place to go that's on the rise and blow this popsicle stand while the gettin's good.
not a great position to be in...
i feel your urgency,
ck

I've been thinking on it, and unfortunately, short of starting your own country, I can't think of a place that would be better. It may get to a point when that is no longer true, and I sure as hell hope not, but we'll see. All the appointments Obama has been making has not inspired much confidence in me. I had been thinking that I should move to one of the territories held by the US, but not yet a state, but I'm not sure how great that would work out either. Guam does sound like a fun place to live, though, don't it?

thanx for that post boabrotha,
sadly we have thusly regressed (progressed).
ck

We have indeed.. it's sad how these politicians tell us they are progressive, and people think it's a good thing. They should call themselves what they are regressive. lol

now we're either gonna put our kids in harm's way, or find a place to go that's on the rise and blow this popsicle stand while the gettin's good.

ck

We'll have to put our children in harms way and hope for the best. Blowin' this popsicle stand is NOT an option. Besides where would you go and know you'd be safe? There is no place left.

It's starting to feel like the last chopper out of Siagon, or Custers last stand, the rest of the country had already been overtaken by the communists and thirty minutes after that chopper left, Siagon fell.

Quig

I still believe that America is the greatest country in the world and I signed my name to that statement and swore to die for my country if she needed me to but this statement really hit home for me

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage.

I believe we are in the final stages of the fall of a great nation. We have become so DEPENDANT on our government to make all of our decisions and expect that if something goes wrong or we run our businesses into the ground that the government will automatically be there to BAIL US OUT!

Look I may be only 24 years old but I've been an avid follower of politics since I was 10 years old and the state our country is in is one of the saddest it has ever been. It will take a TRUE revolution, where the people who are being "governed" TAKE BACK THE GOVERNMENT! Whether this happens peacefully or violently is still to be decided but I believe that if America as we know it is to survive we are getting to a point where a revolution by the people of our great nation must happen.

Just my opinion take it or leave it.

It will take a TRUE revolution, where the people who are being "governed" TAKE BACK THE GOVERNMENT! Whether this happens peacefully or violently is still to be decided but I believe that if America as we know it is to survive we are getting to a point where a revolution by the people of our great nation must happen.



Well said. I agree 100%. I'm just to friggin' old to start it.

Quig

I believe we are in the final stages of the fall of a great nation. We have become so DEPENDANT on our government to make all of our decisions and expect that if something goes wrong or we run our businesses into the ground that the government will automatically be there to BAIL US OUT!

Look I may be only 24 years old but I've been an avid follower of politics since I was 10 years old and the state our country is in is one of the saddest it has ever been. It will take a TRUE revolution, where the people who are being "governed" TAKE BACK THE GOVERNMENT! Whether this happens peacefully or violently is still to be decided but I believe that if America as we know it is to survive we are getting to a point where a revolution by the people of our great nation must happen.

Just my opinion take it or leave it.

It does seem that a lot of americans want a cradle to the grave type society. I think it has alot to do with the indoctrination of our children in public schools and college campuses. I work at a University, and see the effects the "professors" have on the minds of these kids. And the majority of these professors are extreme liberals or socialists. They are teaching kids and have no real world experience of their own. They have only lived in the world of academia, and not the world of business or what have you.. We have professors teaching economics that know nothing of the subject except the theories they have read in books, and since most of them are liberals, they lean towards teaching these marxist philosophies. It drives me nuts. Just like if you look at Obama's economic transition team, there isn't a single person on it that has ANY business experience. They are all just academics...

I think you may be right as far as it may be necessary for a violent episode to take back our government. I hope to god that it can be done in a different manner. I hope that the next 4 years don't go anywhere near as bad and as devastating to our rights, liberty, republic and constitution. I hope that people will wake up to what is being forced down their throats in the name of fairness and get a real leader that really believes in the fundamentals of what this nation was founded on to bring this country together. I hope that we can return to an era of personal responsibility and accountability rather than having laws and government to keep us safe from ourselves or to bail us out of what ever mistakes we make. I'd love to see a revival of the philosophies that came about at the time of the founding of the country, such as the economic ideas proffered by the likes of Adam Smith and others. I'd love to see a majority of Americans really think about things like these instead of watching MTV or the newest sitcom. There's been alot of things that have happened to turn this society into what it has become today, and I don't know exactly what can be done to turn it around. But, if our government turns to tyranny, we may very well have to take up arms to take it back.

America is a great country no doubt. This is an outsiders veiw looking in. The Bush administration has without doubt made America look very stupid indeed around the world. When Obama got in the whole world breathed a sigh of relief. Waging war and spending tax dollars by the billion is not the answer. Bush has made a real big mess of things.
Obama is not perfect but he's smart, considered and has integrity. America's and the worlds future is a damn sight brighter now than it has been for the past 8 years. Don't give up just yet!!:yessir:

^^


I'd love to see a majority of Americans really think about things like these instead of watching MTV or the newest sitcom. There's been alot of things that have happened to turn this society into what it has become today, and I don't know exactly what can be done to turn it around. But, if our government turns to tyranny, we may very well have to take up arms to take it back.

Agreed. I was homeschooled which I think was one of the best things my parents ever did for me. Plus I started working when I was 9 years old shoveling dog crap for my next door neighbor so I learned about the REAL world early early on.

It really pisses me off that people (like my girlfriend), young people especially seem to want someone to just tell them how they should think instead of learning the FACTS and then drawing a conclusion based on the truth and their beliefs. Unfortunately the state of the media and the government (which might as well control the media) is such that true FACTS are extremely hard to come by from the major media sources. People seem to just not want to know or learn about hard truths and ignore them until they turn into a trillion dollar bailout that will be affecting MY GRANDCHILDREN AND GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDCHILDREN. It's sad and it really gets me fired up so sorry if I'm rambling here. I try to teach people what I know but they just don't want to listen.

Just my opinion take it or leave it.

America is a great country no doubt. This is an outsiders veiw looking in. The Bush administration has without doubt made America look very stupid indeed around the world. When Obama got in the whole world breathed a sigh of relief. Waging war and spending tax dollars by the billion is not the answer. Bush has made a real big mess of things.
Obama is not perfect but he's smart, considered and has integrity. America's and the worlds future is a damn sight brighter now than it has been for the past 8 years. Don't give up just yet!!:yessir:

I will never call Obama my president. He's going to be the end of this country as we know it. HE IS A COMMUNIST and communism has never in the history of the world worked.

America is a great country no doubt. This is an outsiders veiw looking in. The Bush administration has without doubt made America look very stupid indeed around the world. When Obama got in the whole world breathed a sigh of relief. Waging war and spending tax dollars by the billion is not the answer. Bush has made a real big mess of things.
Obama is not perfect but he's smart, considered and has integrity. America's and the worlds future is a damn sight brighter now than it has been for the past 8 years. Don't give up just yet!!:yessir:

This is the reason I'm glad that the rest of the world has no vote in our nation's politics. I think ALOT of people have been hoodwinked by the Obama campaign... Integrity? You've GOT to be joking. He may be intelligent, but I'd rather have someone of average intelligence that has experience and believes in the values that this country was founded upon than an over educated academic ANY DAY.

^^



Agreed. I was homeschooled which I think was one of the best things my parents ever did for me. Plus I started working when I was 9 years old shoveling dog crap for my next door neighbor so I learned about the REAL world early early on.

It really pisses me off that people (like my girlfriend), young people especially seem to want someone to just tell them how they should think instead of learning the FACTS and then drawing a conclusion based on the truth and their beliefs. Unfortunately the state of the media and the government (which might as well control the media) is such that true FACTS are extremely hard to come by from the major media sources. People seem to just not want to know or learn about hard truths and ignore them until they turn into a trillion dollar bailout that will be affecting MY GRANDCHILDREN AND GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDCHILDREN. It's sad and it really gets me fired up so sorry if I'm rambling here. I try to teach people what I know but they just don't want to listen.

Just my opinion take it or leave it.

You know, it seems these days that the mainstream media here does voluntarily what the soviet media was FORCED to do under communism. I heard a quote by Ezra Taft Benson, while he was secretary of Agriculture and met with Khrushchev. Khrushchev had told him that they would keep feeding america little bits of socialism until one day we woke up and had full fledged communism. It really seems that is what has been happening over the last 50 or so years.

I don't know if it's people don't want to know, if they just don't care, or if they really believe that the government has all the answers. I hope that it's just that they don't get the information from the major sources, and think that that's all there is to it. I may be being naive, but it's my hope, at least. I too try to educate people whenever I can. I get to talk to alot of college students, and I try to encourage them to find out what they truly believe and what their values are, and what the truth is behind what these politicians say, so they can make an informed decision. I find it disgusting that when I ask alot of people why they support one person over another, they really don't know. They've all been fired up about their right to vote, but have forgotten their obligation to know what they are voting for. Honestly, I wouldn't care what conclusion they came to, as long as they came to it by doing their homework and really knowing what these people are all about, the principles this country was founded upon, the lessons from the history of this and other countries, etc. If they really had an informed decision, I don't care what that decision is.

Another problem I see in this country is the perversion of history. We have people rewriting history to serve a current political purpose. We have democrats telling people that they were champions of civil rights, when nothing could be farther from the truth.. We had democrats blockading school house doors with fire houses, democrats passing Jim Crow Laws, etc. We've got people rewriting the history of different socialist countries, trying to make them look more successful than the utter failures they ended up being.

...America was intended to be a Constitutional Republic......not a Democratic nation....

...America was intended to be a Constitutional Republic......not a Democratic nation....

True but it is still a nation governed "By the People, For the People."

Not "By Career BSing politicians, For Career BSing Politicians."

One of my favorite quotes is by Thomas Jefferson. He said when it comes to government this is the standard we should hold, "Does it break my leg or pick my pocket?" Meaning government should be able to do what needs to be done as long as they do not physically harm me and do not STEAL my money!

...America was intended to be a Constitutional Republic......not a Democratic nation....

It's a democratic republic.. Which is probably one of the reasons we didn't fail much sooner.. But, it's still a majority that decide who is elected to office, which makes the theory still apply. The people have voted in the man they think is going to give them money from the public treasury. The few elected officials are still bound by the constitution and can still do what they feel is right, regardless of what the majority want them to do, but they won't stay in office long if they disregard the people's wishes and we've seen how they are getting around the constitution.

One of my favorite quotes is by Thomas Jefferson. He said when it comes to government this is the standard we should hold, "Does it break my leg or pick my pocket?" Meaning government should be able to do what needs to be done as long as they do not physically harm me and do not STEAL my money!

I don't know how much I agree with that statement. I've never heard it before, but I think there's alot that government can do, that isn't necessarily a role they should have, that doesn't equate to physical harm or stealing of money. There are all sorts of rights being violated by different governments, including our own that don't equate to either physical harm or theft of monetary value. It does come at a loss of liberty, though. And I'm sure that liberty was a main focus of the framers, especially Jefferson. I don't doubt he may have said it, I just don't think that is how we should judge our standard of government.

You know, it seems these days that the mainstream media here does voluntarily what the soviet media was FORCED to do under communism. I heard a quote by Ezra Taft Benson, while he was secretary of Agriculture and met with Khrushchev. Khrushchev had told him that they would keep feeding america little bits of socialism until one day we woke up and had full fledged communism. It really seems that is what has been happening over the last 50 or so years.

I don't know if it's people don't want to know, if they just don't care, or if they really believe that the government has all the answers. I hope that it's just that they don't get the information from the major sources, and think that that's all there is to it. I may be being naive, but it's my hope, at least. I too try to educate people whenever I can. I get to talk to alot of college students, and I try to encourage them to find out what they truly believe and what their values are, and what the truth is behind what these politicians say, so they can make an informed decision. I find it disgusting that when I ask alot of people why they support one person over another, they really don't know. They've all been fired up about their right to vote, but have forgotten their obligation to know what they are voting for. Honestly, I wouldn't care what conclusion they came to, as long as they came to it by doing their homework and really knowing what these people are all about, the principles this country was founded upon, the lessons from the history of this and other countries, etc. If they really had an informed decision, I don't care what that decision is.

Another problem I see in this country is the perversion of history. We have people rewriting history to serve a current political purpose. We have democrats telling people that they were champions of civil rights, when nothing could be farther from the truth.. We had democrats blockading school house doors with fire houses, democrats passing Jim Crow Laws, etc. We've got people rewriting the history of different socialist countries, trying to make them look more successful than the utter failures they ended up being.

as usual lucid nails it on the freakin' head. historic revisionism is alive and well here, and at the same time undoing that which was. generations from now will forget why this country was so great when it was great. and from another post, can't expect euro-woody to understand the truth here when he's only being fed the trash the media wants him to hear. it's the only info he has...
pray hard people,
ck

I don't know how much I agree with that statement. I've never heard it before, but I think there's alot that government can do, that isn't necessarily a role they should have, that doesn't equate to physical harm or stealing of money. There are all sorts of rights being violated by different governments, including our own that don't equate to either physical harm or theft of monetary value. It does come at a loss of liberty, though. And I'm sure that liberty was a main focus of the framers, especially Jefferson. I don't doubt he may have said it, I just don't think that is how we should judge our standard of government.

True but look at that as the ultimate test of whether government is going way over the line. True there are a lot of things that fall outside of those guidelines but if either of those statements "Does it break my leg or pick my pocket?" are violated you should KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt that your government is no longer working for you it is working very much against you.

as usual lucid nails it on the freakin' head. historic revisionism is alive and well here, and at the same time undoing that which was. generations from now will forget why this country was so great when it was great. and from another post, can't expect euro-woody to understand the truth here when he's only being fed the trash the media wants him to hear. it's the only info he has...
pray hard people,
ck
Before you start patronising me, I worked in the US for three years as a photojournalist. I have a lot of friends and clients in the US whom which I am in contact on a daily basis. Pretty much I see it from BOTH sides. America is very insular, you guys seem to forget that the US and the UK are very tightly linked. What your president does effects the whole world not just the USA. As for trash media, I'd say the BBC has the edge for truth over Fox!

True but look at that as the ultimate test of whether government is going way over the line. True there are a lot of things that fall outside of those guidelines but if either of those statements "Does it break my leg or pick my pocket?" are violated you should KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt that your government is no longer working for you it is working very much against you.

I guess you could use it as an ultimate test. I'd say that our government is already overstepping the bounds, even in areas that don't concern money. We are losing more and more of our rights every day. I suppose if you look at it not in the context of our constitution, though.. In a context where our rights are not inately granted by the creator or naturally endowed upon us, however you want to look at that particular issue, that test would work just fine. In the confines of the this country and our unique constitution, I think that is a very poor test of whether the government is working for us or not. By the time it gets to outright theft and physical harm, it's already gone WAY too far.

democratic republic...
ck

look it up

as usual lucid nails it on the freakin' head. historic revisionism is alive and well here, and at the same time undoing that which was. generations from now will forget why this country was so great when it was great. and from another post, can't expect euro-woody to understand the truth here when he's only being fed the trash the media wants him to hear. it's the only info he has...
pray hard people,
ck

Thanks, CK. It is sad how our history is being undone for political ideals that have already failed in the past. I heard something once as a corallary to socialism, "If someone built a new plane, and the first 3 test pilots that flew it had died from a crash, would you really want to be that 4th test pilot? Would you really think that those other pilots were just too stupid to get it right?" It's exactly what goes on today. People think that they are smarter than those people that tried socialism before, want to trash the only completely successful economic / social model, because they will get it right this time..

Woody, of course if you look at things in the US with a European prospective, it will seem that things are backwards. Europeans have been experimenting with more and more socialism for decades. I don't want to live in a country where it's no longer acceptable to defend yourself in your own home with a gun. I don't want to live in a country where because healthcare is a right, the standard of care is lessened for everyone. I don't want to live in a country that taxes my productivity in order to pay for someone else's so called rights. I love the fact that the rights granted by the creator in our constitution are rights that can not place a burden on any other person. I think this country has been heading in the wrong direction for quite awhile now, and if the things that Obama has been saying appeals to most Europeans, he isn't the man to lead this country. I can't believe some of the things that go on in government in Europe. Rights for plants? Giving children a vote? They don't even have the understanding to know how that vote will effect things. They are alot easier to convince to vote one way or another, though.

I don't mean to sound rude or anything. I've been all over Europe, lived in Germany, Scotland and France for a time.. It's a beautiful area. I just think it's a shame what your governments have been doing. It's a shame just how liberal alot of people are over there, and it permeates everything from your government to your media. I don't have access to the BBC, all I get over here is BBC America, which I'm sure is very different. I have no way to know whether the BBC is more "honest" than Fox News. But, if they are anything like the UK Guardian and other newspapers that I do get over here, I wouldn't say anything like that. Personally, I think all of the media outlets are at the very least a little biased, one way or the other. If I had to choose one, though, that was the most balanced and honest, it would be Fox. I'm just talking their news, now. Their commentary is pretty conservative, for the most part. Their news, VERY very honest and balanced according to the facts.

look it up

A constitutional republic is a form of democracy. All constitutional republics are democracies, not all democracies are constitutional republics. Even though steps were taken to minimize the threat of "mob rule" that generally occurs in complete democracies, this form of government still has it's officials elected by popular vote or the electoral college, in the case of the president, which really ends up just being popular vote according to each state. The other branch which is supposed to check the other two is appointed by the first two. Our representatives are supposed to act in accordance with the constitution, but, as we have been afraid of, there are ways around our rights. Also, since the majority elects the officials, who can create or repeal amendments to the constitution, which needs to be ratified by 3/4 of the states and a 2/3's vote in congress, the rights of the few can still be taken away by the majority. It just takes a few extra steps.

I do think that we have the best form of government that is currently in existence. I can't think of a better way. I think we might benefit from a change in our voting system from a "First Past the Post" system to an "Instant Runoff Voting" system. Which is essentially where you get to choose a first, second, third, etc. choice for your vote. It would allow people to be able to vote their concience better, rather than voting the lesser of two evils, since that third party guy won't win. If anyone is interested in learning about IRV, I encourage you to look it up. Some people have proposed we change our system to a proportional representation system, but I don't really agree with a change to our system that radical. I also think it would bring out some of the really radical moonbats and put them in government. Anyways, I'm going off on a tangent. I love our constitution, I love our system of government. I hate that we are being overtaken by radicals from the inside out. We are having problems in all of our institutions; Education, Economic, etc. We have radicals doing what they can to tear our system down, give people no choice but to believe that our way has failed, that we must turn to them for the answers. Our children are being indoctrinated into liberalism in school, they are being taught a perversion of history. Our economic institutions are being corrupted by liberal politicians and groups like ACORN that bully them into making bad financial decisions. Our corporations are going under due to unions and being bullied into making commitments that are unsustainable. And the liberal mainstream media will tell us that it was unbridled capitalism that has failed. When in fact, it was the regulation and unlawful actions of groups that did us in.

What was I talking about again? I don't know how I got from where I started to there, but whatever...

Anyone else hear about Obamas plan to build a "Civilian Police Force"? Seems to me like every dictator in the history of the world has had his own ARMED thugs.
We're just a step away from the damn thought police. Hello Gestapo.

And his "mandatory volunteer work for children and retired

http://change.gov/americaserves/

Sooooo basically you want to take our children and indoctrinate them? Where do you think these kids are going to be performing this "community service"? I'll tell ya right now it's not going to be in neighborhoods I would want my kids going into.

Amen Jeff!

What a perfect quote. Anyone that studies history can see it repeating itself.


"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson

Anyone else hear about Obamas plan to build a "Civilian Police Force"? Seems to me like every dictator in the history of the world has had his own ARMED thugs.
We're just a step away from the damn thought police. Hello Gestapo.

And his "mandatory volunteer work for children and retired

http://change.gov/americaserves/

Sooooo basically you want to take our children and indoctrinate them? Where do you think these kids are going to be performing this "community service"? I'll tell ya right now it's not going to be in neighborhoods I would want my kids going into.


I love how it's "The Office of the President-Elect". When has there ever been an office of the president-elect? It's absolutely ridiculous how arrogant he is.

God only knows what will happen to people with opposing political ideas once the ObamaManiacs are set on the loose with their armbands or whatever they get to identify themselves. Even if they aren't given instructions to harrass or beat up people that don't think like they do, I'm sure it won't be long before it starts happening. I mean, kids in schools were already being called racist and names because they didn't support him as their candidate. Just wait till we see what goes on when we've got volunteers to his Brown Shirts.. oh, I mean Americorps.

Before you start patronising me, I worked in the US for three years as a photojournalist. I have a lot of friends and clients in the US whom which I am in contact on a daily basis. Pretty much I see it from BOTH sides. America is very insular, you guys seem to forget that the US and the UK are very tightly linked. What your president does effects the whole world not just the USA. As for trash media, I'd say the BBC has the edge for truth over Fox!

america is very insular ?
check your statistics brother woody...
americans have given more to the world than the world could ever repay.
and... we're not looking for retribution.
hardly an insular mentality.
and no, we haven't forgot the uk's allegiance, nor can we or england, deny the mutual benefit.
ck

democratic republic...
ck

we live in a constitutional republic not a democratic republic
democratic republic can vote any way they want
constitutional republic has to vote with the constitution rights we have
not that they always do but there is a big difference between the two
but now we all live in the bush-league now and it rocks

we live in a constitutional republic not a democratic republic
democratic republic can vote any way they want
constitutional republic has to vote with the constitution rights we have
not that they always do but there is a big difference between the two
but now we all live in the bush-league now and it rocks

They don't have to vote with the constitution.. There are hundreds of amendments that are proposed every year. There have been proposed amendments that would essentially repeal some of our rights. Thankfully, we haven't had enough loon's in congress vote to get the amendment to go to the states, yet. It looks like we may be on the verge, though. When there are enough radicals and people that are ignorant of what is going on in government, it may not be long before we have some amendments that repeal our rights.

Also, like I said before, even though in a constitutional republic, there are steps to try to curtail mob rule and to prevent a politician from ever gaining absolute power, it's still possible and seems likely that these things will eventually happen. The checks and balances aren't as balanced as it might seem. We have elected politicians appointing judges that will legislate from the bench and defend unconstitutional acts by these politicians. The politicians have also come up with alot of sneaky ways to limit our rights that we can't do anything about besides vote for someone else next time.

You're right, there is a big difference between the two forms of democracy. A constitutional republic is a much better system, but, in the end, it's still up to the majority as to what happens, in most cases. And let's all hope that the Bush League will stick around until the "thought police" come a knocking.

They don't have to vote with the constitution.. There are hundreds of amendments that are proposed every year. There have been proposed amendments that would essentially repeal some of our rights. Thankfully, we haven't had enough loon's in congress vote to get the amendment to go to the states, yet. It looks like we may be on the verge, though. When there are enough radicals and people that are ignorant of what is going on in government, it may not be long before we have some amendments that repeal our rights.

Also, like I said before, even though in a constitutional republic, there are steps to try to curtail mob rule and to prevent a politician from ever gaining absolute power, it's still possible and seems likely that these things will eventually happen. The checks and balances aren't as balanced as it might seem. We have elected politicians appointing judges that will legislate from the bench and defend unconstitutional acts by these politicians. The politicians have also come up with alot of sneaky ways to limit our rights that we can't do anything about besides vote for someone else next time.

You're right, there is a big difference between the two forms of democracy. A constitutional republic is a much better system, but, in the end, it's still up to the majority as to what happens, in most cases. And let's all hope that the Bush League will stick around until the "thought police" come a knocking.

^^ right on brother, couldn't have said it better myself. :yourock::machinegun: