Anyone else feeding ASFs exclusively? I have 90% of my Balls switched over to ASFs and love the results I am seeing. All my hold back hatchlings from last year are over 1300 grams. And no I aint power feeding. I let them eat 1-3 ASFs once a week. They never refuse a meal.

Same with my adults. All of the ASF eaters eat almost every week where as the rat eaters tend to miss more meals. The ASF eaters also put on much more weight than the rat eaters. But that would only make sense since the ASF eaters eat more consistently.

My females that laid this year put the weight back on and then some very quickly compared to the rat eaters as well. I have not seen found a single draw back to feeding ASFs. In my opinion they are the ideal feeder for Balls and other mid sized snakes.

However, I do start my hatchlings that I am going to sell on common rats though as a common courtesy to my customers. I understand that not everyone has access to ASFs and I dont want to get them started on a food source that they buyer can not provide.

Anyone else out there switching their Balls over to ASFs?

Honestly I have better results with ASF's with all the snakes especially the cornsnakes.

I have a couple of balls that will only eat ASF's but they are also the one rat per feeding type. I do have a yearling female that hit a wall at 800 grams this year and I switched her to ASF's and she is now around 1200. Funny thing is she prefers them FT like the corns...:lol:

I love them because the smell - Hellva lot better that the smell of rats and mice...But I hate them because mine are evil mean...:SAMHAIN:...That and ever colony I've ever had were chewers...But the BP's do love em...I raise mine mainly for a Jungle Carpet female that's hooked on them -

I love them because the smell - Hellva lot better that the smell of rats and mice...But I hate them because mine are evil mean...:SAMHAIN:...That and ever colony I've ever had were chewers...But the BP's do love em...I raise mine mainly for a Jungle Carpet female that's hooked on them -

Give them a wheel, BT. They stop chewing. Completely. They are high strung and NEED something to do. I got 14 different breeding tubs of them. A wheel in each tub. None of them chew anymore thanks to cheap metal $2 wheels.

Give them a wheel, BT. They stop chewing. Completely. They are high strung and NEED something to do. I got 14 different breeding tubs of them. A wheel in each tub. None of them chew anymore thanks to cheap metal $2 wheels.

Are your evil mean bitters like mine Sammy? LOL...

Are your evil mean bitters like mine Sammy? LOL...

Some parents with babies are indeed protective and will try to take a chunk out of you.

But the ones in the grow out/holding tubs are nice as pie. I can literally stick my hand down into a pile of 100 in the grow out tubs and they could not care less about me being there. I have NEVER been bit or even had an attempt from the ones in the grow out tubs in the last year.

But yeah, some of my breeders will tear into you in a heart beat when you get into their tubs. Except when I remove the tub from the rack completely. It is like they know I am doing so to clean it and they pay no attention to me then. But if the tub is still on the rack some will attack.

All in all though I am pretty pleased with my progress in culling out the biters. It took me 2 or 3 years to cull all of the biters out of my common rat colony. I am about 18 months into the process with the ASFs. Hopefully I will have all non biters in another 18 months.

I still feed a lot of rats but I do love the results I have seen with the ASF's.....

I have started a couple of colonys of ASF. I like them so far. They are mean though. I have had good luck getting picky eaters to start eating regularly on ASFs.

The batch of Ch I got from Gib , the pastel from Sammy , the hognose & the albino Nelsoni are all on ASF. I feed the BPs a bit heavy , 3 times a week on smaller than girth ASF to keep holding tubs at a managable level. Lolo likes the pinks to feed her Leos so that helps with the numbers.

I have a few boas that love'm too. The retired adults are PERFECT for my dwarf boas. Only drawback to ASF is the grow out time.

Ill probably get into them eventually.

I have a rack of ASF's going now. I like them but my snakes take rats just as readily.. But the smell is a really nice change from rats! LOL The only thing I don't like is it takes forever for mine to get small to medium rat size.. Does anyone else have this problem??

Alan

Sammy it sounds like you're doing real well with your soft furreds. I just have a few that are housed in 10 gallon aquariums at the moment. Are you using the cement mixing tubs in your rack? What size hardware cloth do you use? Are you using an automatic watering system and if so can the younger rats reach the sippers okay themselves?

Sammy it sounds like you're doing real well with your soft furreds. I just have a few that are housed in 10 gallon aquariums at the moment. Are you using the cement mixing tubs in your rack? What size hardware cloth do you use? Are you using an automatic watering system and if so can the younger rats reach the sippers okay themselves?

I am using Iris CB-30 tubs with 1/4" cloth and have 64 ounce water bottles. I also have the really small igloo rodent hides in each tub. Not so much for a hide, but as a platform for younger ones to reach the water.

And as I found out the hard way, younger ASFs will fit through 1/2" cloth.

And as I found out the hard way, younger ASFs will fit through 1/2" cloth.

Good to hear I wasn't the only one, alot more info out there now then a few years back when I first got my original trio...what a fun adventure that was :lol:

I'm not using them exclusively but I did have some mousers that will take large ASF's with no problem. These are snakes that totally ignore rats but will just destroy an ASF.

I really dig the ASF's cause the never get to big for an adult ball like a regular rat will I just wish they grew faster. :D

I am using Iris CB-30 tubs with 1/4" cloth and have 64 ounce water bottles. I also have the really small igloo rodent hides in each tub. Not so much for a hide, but as a platform for younger ones to reach the water.

And as I found out the hard way, younger ASFs will fit through 1/2" cloth.

Thank you for the info. I am assuming the Iris CB-30 are in the size range of "sweaterbox" tubs? What male to female ratio do you use? What do you like to feed? I agree about the wheel thing. Get the asf's a wheel to run on and all your problems are solved.

Where are you guys getting ASF's?

These things are a Miracle food !!!
I've had some balls from earlier in the year that refused anything but Live
and thats a no no in my house, my wife would kill me -)
Everything that refused DF rats/mice has now taken these guys everytime
Have a nice freezer full.
I've come to the conclusion that there are no bad feeders, i just need to work out exactly what they want.

i don't use asf's but the results sound impressive.
ck

A rat breeder near me has a not quite breeding size male albino ball that wouldn't eat anything for him. He got some ASF's but didn't want to wait months for babies to feed (wants to use the male this winter) so used the ASF bedding to scent Norway rat hoppers and now has the albino eating every 3 days.

I was lucky to get some nice non biters (I think there must be a gene out there for that as it seems they either are biters or they aren't, so if you have biters look for some of the nice ones to replace them with). The only knock I have is the time to get them up to feeder size. They just don't seem to eat very much so I just need more racks so I can get the pipeline full. I supplement with wild bird seed which they really seem to like except for the sorghum (need to avoid brands with high sorghum content) and they nibble on the Mazuri 6F but it will take for ever for them to finish the 50lb bag at this rate.

Can you guys post some pictures of your asf racks

I have them too, love the lack of smell.... if I could get them to share their deoderant with the mice that would be great.... nothing seems to put weight on a bp like a soft furred does....

Still have a few bps that won't touch em, so I'm stuck with mice for some.... but I wouldn't want to be without ASF's!

Everything else eats them also!

I had a small colony going but I sold them all and just stick with Mice and Rats. With me the ASF's just take too long to grow and I haven't found a snake of mine that won't either take a mouse or a rat.

Plus ASF's are banned in my county...

I am not sure if I would go without. I have had two snakes given to me. That wouldn't eat for the original owner one a cinnie the other a Green ghost. Both have really taken to asf.. I have scented them to take regular rats. But they love the smell of asf.

Sammy,

How many ball pythons do you have and how many breeder ASF's do you have to feed them all and keep a steady supply of appropriately sized feeders? I agree, the time getting started up getting enough to size takes some time, but I'm trying to figure out how many are needed as breeders to sustain a ball python collection (I have 22 adults right now and 16 hatchlings/babies).

The hatchlings all pretty much started on ASF hoppers and easily transitioned to rat fuzzies for those that are being sold or re-homed (I give my normal males to good pet homes, rather than sell them).

Robin, sounds like my collection size is very simular to yours and I'm also wondering how many ASF tubs I'll need. My plan is to build to 4 breeder tubs of 1.3 each and three grow out tubs. But I'm not there yet and haven't been doing it long enough to say if that will do the trick or not. Right now I only have two breeder tubs producing and a third from a diferent source that I'm starting to wonder if will ever start and might need replaced.

Another thing I'm wondering from someone who has been working with ASF's much longer than I is how often you have to replace the breeders.

I just recently started really thinking about breeding my own rats and buying a freedom breeder row or two. I have been reading about the asf rats and how great they are. Which would you recommend I breed?

I just recently started really thinking about breeding my own rats and buying a freedom breeder row or two. I have been reading about the asf rats and how great they are. Which would you recommend I breed?

Check with your local laws if you decide to breed ASF's.... the sheer lack of stench is just amazing!

On a side note, it depends on what your feeding too...

All I am feeding and expect to feed is ball pythons. The breeder I buy my rats from sells 1.2 asf rats for $15.00. Is that worth it? I pay $1.20 per small rat that is larger than each of the 1.2 asf rats. I was going to buy 3.9 medium rats and raise them up to breeding size.

All I am feeding and expect to feed is ball pythons. The breeder I buy my rats from sells 1.2 asf rats for $15.00. Is that worth it? I pay $1.20 per small rat that is larger than each of the 1.2 asf rats. I was going to buy 3.9 medium rats and raise them up to breeding size.

2 or 3 years ago you would have paid $100 per trio of ASF's, oh how the times change...LOL

2 or 3 years ago you would have paid $100 per trio of ASF's, oh how the times change...LOL

$100 for a trio of rats? Did they give birth to golden pups back then?
What gives?

$100 for a trio of rats? Did they give birth to golden pups back then?
What gives?

They were great producers, larger litters and ball pythons and my kings ate them like candy so I was hooked...all mine now started from 4 trios back then.

Hardly anyone had them and they are often the checker to get that golden ball python eating. I paid $60 for 2.6 this summer and even though I thought it a little high for nowadays was glad to pay it when I found out they where non biters when so many do bite.

Don't get me wrong, we have added lots of blood to the group and at a much better price then what they were.

All I am feeding and expect to feed is ball pythons. The breeder I buy my rats from sells 1.2 asf rats for $15.00. Is that worth it? I pay $1.20 per small rat that is larger than each of the 1.2 asf rats. I was going to buy 3.9 medium rats and raise them up to breeding size.

That's what I sell mine for as well.

I was running 18 tubs of 1.4. That was giving me an average of 400 - 600 weaned a month.

Thanks to an awesome friend of mine...cough cough jeff....I got a colony of ASF and love them as feeders. so do athe snakes have not switched the bps to them yet till i get more colonies to keep the bigger sizes i need for adults up

$100 for a trio of rats? Did they give birth to golden pups back then?
What gives?

Supply and demand - demand was high and supply of available breeders was low (or less dense than it is now).

Thanks for the numbers Bryon. Looks like maybe I would need 5 breeder tubs for my collection.

How did you manage the grow out and how many tubs did you use for that?

Also, how often did you replace the breeders?

Hardly anyone had them and they are often the checker to get that golden ball python eating. I paid $60 for 2.6 this summer and even though I thought it a little high for nowadays was glad to pay it when I found out they where non biters when so many do bite.

a kinder, gentler, rodent...
a bargain at any price !
ck

Randy, on my asf's the older ones will stare to get small tumors all over them and when I see this happening I will pull the male, let them finish with babies and then replace the group. You will also see production go down also when they are older. The things I have found with asf" is this, ALWAYS GROW UP FEMALES! I breed in groups of 1.4 or 1.5. If the male dies or some females you need to set up a new group. Anything you add, they will kill. To get babies to grow fast feed them a high protien diet but you dont want to feed it to your breeders. I feed mine Harlan rodent food but they love seed and actually love lettuce and other vegetables as well. I run four different grow up tubs and that works well for rotating throught the month. I guess I am lucky to have the non biters as well. Rarely do I get a nibble and I pick them up by handfulls when I clean....

I haven't noticed any tumors yet but I'll take a closer look on cleaning day. I thought I read somewhere about tumors in relation to feeding dog food. Mine get Mazuri 6F and seeds but don't eat a lot of the 6F. I've had them three months and they where probably a couple months old when I got them. Are the 6 month animals or 1 year?

I haven't noticed any tumors yet but I'll take a closer look on cleaning day. I thought I read somewhere about tumors in relation to feeding dog food. Mine get Mazuri 6F and seeds but don't eat a lot of the 6F. I've had them three months and they where probably a couple months old when I got them. Are the 6 month animals or 1 year?

I feed mine rodent diet, they (Some) still get tumors at some point.... I also feed them sunflower seed and bread.... I do 1.4.... and colony breed..... yeah, I'll post pics. I have even had mice in with ASF's with no bad things happening.... I know it's weird!

As for the 1.4 groups, I only add a new male or female on cleaning day and never before. Pretty much the same with mice, always add on cleaning day as soon as that clean bedding is down and not before.

I'll get pics of the 1.4 groups set ups and the colonly breeding as well.

I have had great success with the ASF's, they have replaced regular pet store rats because I just don't really have a need for huge (Cat Sized ) rats running around anymore.

The mice I still need, I still have bps that are mouse eaters only and live mouse eaters at that!

anybody know if there legal in ca. can't seem to find them anywhere.

anybody know if there legal in ca. can't seem to find them anywhere.

They are illegal in CA.

I'll watch for the tumors. I wonder why they tend to get them? Maybe some lines are descendent from lab animal bred to get tumors?

Perhaps most haven't had them long enough but I'm still curious at what age I should plan on replacing a colony. It seems like they might take 3 months to have their first babies so I need to plan ahead if efficient reproductive is only up to 6 months of age but maybe with their slow growth they are long lived if I can somehow avoid the tumors.

I have never fed mine dog food and you will know the tumors when you see them. I always have girls growing up and if you watch them you will know when to change them out.....

I've had my groups going since Mother's Day and still going strong. One of my buddy's just put a girl that was close to 2 years old and she was still pumping out babies damn near to the end.