I just got off the phone with Adam Wysocki, and he asked me to share this message with the forums I participate in:

From 8:30 until 10:00 a.m. Wednesday, July 29th people need to CALL, CALL, CALL and this time your message needs to be:

I would like to ask that expert testimony is heard before the Senator votes.

Everyone needs to flood the phone lines tomorrow morning with this message. This is NOT going before a sub-committee like HR669 did, it's going straight to committee tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m. EST, and some of the Senators Adam talked to said that they were not reptile experts, and didn't feel comfortable voting without hearing some expert testimony first. So we need to drill that message home!

Thanks to everyone who has made their calls and continue to pound the phones.

Are we talking about HR2811? If so that's a House bill, not a Senate bill. Can you clarify???

Sorry - got my terminology mixed up - Yes HR2811, and I meant to say Congressmen.

PIJAC Pet Alert:

During the House Judiciary Subcommittee Markup Session this afternoon, NO AMENDMENTS were offered. Only a few members spoke. One felt that they did not have sufficient knowledge to formulate appropriate amendments and requested testimony from reptile experts so they would be able to educate themselves to make an informed and proper decision. The Chair mentioned that Representative Rooney would submit a proposed amendment during the Full Judiciary Committee Markup Session tomorrow, July 29. The proposal would limit the ban to Burmese and African Rock Pythons. There is no indication that exceptions for interstate movement of animals already possessed in the United States would be permitted.

The full Judiciary Committee will hold a Markup Session tomorrow July 29 at 10:00 a.m. Eastern Standard Time. You can watch it on the Internet by going to http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/calendar.html and clicking on "Watch Video Webcast" for July 29 under "FULL COMMITTEE."

IT IS IMPORTANT for concerned pet owners from all around the country to contact members of the FULL COMMITTEE via telephone, Fax and email to encourage them to seek expert input. Complete contact information for the full House Judiciary Committee can be found by viewing page 3 of PIJAC's July 27 PetAlert.

To contact your own Representative, and to view helpful talking points, enter your Zip Code in the 'Call Now' box or 'Take Action' link and tell your Representative to convey your concerns to their colleagues on the Judiciary Committee!

BEWARE that this sets a dangerous precedent by simply adding controversial species to the Lacey Act without hearings and better understanding of the issues. While today it might be your Burmese Python, tomorrow it might be your pet bird, turtle or fish due to a perceived "danger!"

http://capwiz.com/pijac/callalert/index.tt?alertid=13804911

Question: How do we convince said committee members that we are "experts"?

I mean, yeah I can start my conversation with who ever answers the phone with "My name is Dr. Travis Wyman and I am calling as a reptile expert to voice my opposition to..." But I am going to guess that not everyone on the board holds an advanced degree that they can throw in the face of the committee members..

Question: How do we convince said committee members that we are "experts"?

I mean, yeah I can start my conversation with who ever answers the phone with "My name is Dr. Travis Wyman and I am calling as a reptile expert to voice my opposition to..." But I am going to guess that not everyone on the board holds an advanced degree that they can throw in the face of the committee members..

We are all experts compared to what they know.... maybe there is more to it, I don't know. :dunno:

You aren't supposed to be an expert - you are just requesting that they look into getting one - the guy who lead testimony today requested one before moving forward so that they knew that they were doing everything possible. At first this sounded like a good idea -- but what they are looking for is a reason to ban more than just the two big ones -- I'm almost sure of it. An expert would certainly show up that lying piece of work that spoke second tho -- but I didn't get that it was in our best interest to have one. :dunno:

Here's Adam's update
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jul 28
QUICK UPDATE: HR 2811
Adam Wysocki Legislative Process, hr 2811 Add you comment

Just got back in the office from the HR 2811 hearing in Washington, D.C. and I wanted to post about what happened.

In case you don’t know, HR 2811 is a proposed bill in Congress that seeks to amend existing legislation to ban the interstate transport, import, and export, of 7 species of pythons. These seven species include one of the most popular pet snakes in the country … the ball python.

Even if you’re not a snake fan, HR 2811 should scare the life out of you. This is the first time ever that the US Congress, without testimony form experts or any facts based in real science, has attempted to ban a species that has been in the pet trade for decades. Pet owners should be very concerned.

At todays meeting in Congress, only three of the dozen or so Congressmen chose to speak … The committee chair read a statement and stated that an amendment would be introduced at the full committee markup meeting to limit the ban to only burmese pythons and rock pythons. It is not clear if captive bred pets will be affected.

The ranking member, Rep Gohmert, called for scientific testimony so that he could make an informed decision. He stated that no one on the subcommittee was a reptile expert.

Representative Wasserman Schultz from Florida called for a ban on even more species to prevent potential future “invasions” (this statement should scare everyone with a pet) … She also lied to the subcommittee and stated that all 100,000 pythons in the everglades were confirmed to be released pets … probably one of the biggest lies perpetrated on the American public.

Tomorrow morning at 10am is the full committee meeting. It’s not a vote, just the next step in the life of HR 2811 … I’ll be there and will report on what happened as soon as I get home.

In the mean time … keep calling!!! …. Tell the committee members that you would like for them to hear expert testimony so that they can inform and educate themselves before HR 2811 goes any further. Even if you don’t own a snake, call … if they can do this to one or two species of pet, they can do it to all of them!

For more information, check out this link at PIJAC. Scroll down to where it says “U.S. House Judiciary Committee To Consider Python Ban This Week” and then TAKE ACTION!!!

Adam Wysocki
www.nohr669.com

We are all experts compared to what they know.... maybe there is more to it, I don't know. :dunno:

Sput,

Do not get me wrong, I know we are experts, especially when compared to the committee members.

But the question is, how do we convince them of that. Obviously anyone can call and claim to be an "expert" and I am going to guess that the committee members and their sycophants are ware of that. So there has to be some way to get them to take our calls more seriously, as actual experts vs. yahoos just claiming to be experts.... You know what I mean?


Perhaps if, when we call, we start our response with:

"My name is ___________, I have been keeping reptiles for _____ years. I would like to offer my expertise on the matter of HR2811. As the bill is written I must stringently oppose it because..."


By throwing how long we have been keeping out and using the word "expertise" it may make more of an impact.

Maybe we should request USARK be allowed to address the committee?

Sput,

Do not get me wrong, I know we are experts, especially when compared to the committee members.

But the question is, how do we convince them of that. Obviously anyone can call and claim to be an "expert" and I am going to guess that the committee members and their sycophants are ware of that. So there has to be some way to get them to take our calls more seriously, as actual experts vs. yahoos just claiming to be experts.... You know what I mean?


Perhaps if, when we call, we start our response with:

"My name is ___________, I have been keeping reptiles for _____ years. I would like to offer my expertise on the matter of HR2811. As the bill is written I must stringently oppose it because..."


By throwing how long we have been keeping out and using the word "expertise" it may make more of an impact.

If an expert were to give testimony, I'd like for it to be Greg Graziani - due to his involvement with the python hunt etc and he really does keep his cool under pressure....

You aren't supposed to be an expert - you are just requesting that they look into getting one - the guy who lead testimony today requested one before moving forward so that they knew that they were doing everything possible.


Gotcha. That makes more sense...

Okay, everyone ignore my above. I am a tool.

Certainly having USARK speak for the community as an expert would be beneficial -- I would bet if they do get an "expert" it'll be in the same lines as the experts that predicted that burms could migrate over 3/4 of the US. The wrong expert might just sink our ship entirely.

Gotcha. That makes more sense...

Okay, everyone ignore my above. I am a tool.

don't even get me started on your toolyness....
(oh wait, it's your birthday. sorry)

Okay, how about this for an idea.

Hit the committee members with the following:


The Executive Order on scientific integrity:

THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary
For Immediate Release March 9, 2009
March 9, 2009



MEMORANDUM FOR THE HEADS OF EXECUTIVE DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES
SUBJECT: Scientific Integrity

Science and the scientific process must inform and guide decisions of my Administration on a wide range of issues, including improvement of public health, protection of the environment, increased efficiency in the use of energy and other resources, mitigation of the threat of climate change, and protection of national security.
The public must be able to trust the science and scientific process informing public policy decisions. Political officials should not suppress or alter scientific or technological findings and conclusions. If scientific and technological information is developed and used by the Federal Government, it should ordinarily be made available to the public. To the extent permitted by law, there should be transparency in the preparation, identification, and use of scientific and technological information in policymaking. The selection of scientists and technology professionals for positions in the executive branch should be based on their scientific and technological knowledge, credentials, experience, and integrity.



By this memorandum, I assign to the Director of the Office of Science and Technology Policy (Director) the responsibility for ensuring the highest level of integrity in all aspects of the executive branch's involvement with scientific and technological processes. The Director shall confer, as appropriate, with the heads of executive departments and agencies, including the Office of Management and Budget and offices and agencies
more within the Executive Office of the President (collectively, the "agencies"), and recommend a plan to achieve that goal throughout the executive branch.
Specifically, I direct the following:

1. Within 120 days from the date of this memorandum, the Director shall develop recommendations for Presidential action designed to guarantee scientific integrity throughout the executive branch, based on the following principles: (a) The selection and retention of candidates for science and technology positions in the executive branch should be based on the candidate's knowledge, credentials, experience, and integrity;
(b) Each agency should have appropriate rules and procedures to ensure the integrity of the scientific process within the agency; (c) When scientific or technological information is considered in policy decisions, the information should be subject to well-established scientific processes, including peer review where appropriate, and each agency should appropriately and accurately reflect that information in complying with and applying relevant statutory standards; (d) Except for information that is properly restricted from disclosure under procedures established in accordance with statute, regulation, Executive Order, or Presidential Memorandum, each agency should make available to the public the scientific or technological findings or conclusions considered or relied on in policy decisions; (e) Each agency should have in place procedures to identify and address instances in which the scientific process or the integrity of scientific and technological information may be compromised; and (f) Each agency should adopt such additional procedures, including any appropriate whistleblower protections, as are necessary to ensure the integrity of scientific and technological information and processes on which the agency relies in its decisionmaking or otherwise uses or prepares.

2. Each agency shall make available any and all information deemed by the Director to be necessary to inform the Director in making recommendations to the President as requested by this memorandum. Each agency shall coordinate with the Director in the development of any interim procedures deemed necessary to ensure the integrity of scientific decisionmaking pending the Director's recommendations called for by this memorandum.

3. (a) Executive departments and agencies shall carry out the provisions of this memorandum to the extent permitted by law and consistent with their statutory and regulatory authorities and their enforcement mechanisms.(b) Nothing in this memorandum shall be construed to impair or otherwise affect: (i) authority granted by law to an executive department, agency, or the head thereof; or (ii) functions of the Director of the Office of Management and Budget relating to budgetary, administrative, or legislative proposals. (c) This memorandum is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity, by any party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person.

4. The Director is hereby authorized and directed to publish this memorandum in the Federal Register.


BARACK OBAMA

Remind them of this. Lean on this. Hell, if we the reptile community can push this Executive Order on them we might be able to catch them at their own game. You need not like Obama but his demand for transparency on scientific decisions works in our favor.

Tommorow 8:30-10:00am, Phone blast, Im Spreading the word now.

I'm thinking of faxing this in to all of the committee members tonight. What do you think?



Hi, my name is William Hicok. I would like to urge everyone on the committee dealing with HR2811 to bring in experts with practical experience and knowledge to testify before a vote be taken. I think the bill and amendments should be open to viewing and response from the public before any vote is taken. The public notification that this was going to happen was extremely short and many people that have animals affected by this regulation have no idea its taking place. One expert I ask be allowed to testify is Andrew Wyatt of USARK. He is one of the most knowledgeable and experienced people in this field that would be willing to testify. Most of the people that have been involved with writing this and the one that testified yesterday do not have a scientific basis for this regulation. To say the Burmese python problem is 100% pet released animals is absurd.


Please note the attached executive order released from the White House March 9, 2009. It states:

“When scientific or technological information is considered in policy decisions, the information should be subject to well-established scientific processes, including peer review where appropriate, and each agency should appropriately and accurately reflect that information in complying with and applying relevant statutory standards.”


I have yet to see any of this regulation to be subject to any well-established scientific processes. That is all I ask before this goes to any vote.


Thanks for you consideration,
William Hicok

Swap William with Bill.. :devil:

That executive order should be used everytime there is some knee jerk stupid ban on the table....

Nice write up Bill! :cheers:

Swap William with Bill.. :devil:

Gotta sound all proper and s..t. :lmao:

That executive order should be used everytime there is some knee jerk stupid ban on the table....

Nice write up Bill! :cheers:

Thank you kind Sir!!! :cheers:

Excellent write up William -- may I plagiarize from it?

Excellent write up William -- may I plagiarize from it?

I was thinking the same thing, just not telling him....

Excellent write up William -- may I plagiarize from it?

***In my best 3 Stooges Curly voice***

Certainly, woow owowowwowwwoooooo

I just figured I write it up and fax tonight, since I'm usually busy right away in the morning getting the father in law to adult daycare.

All done and faxed to all committee members!!!

Here's my plagiarized version:
----------------------
Subject: Expert Testimony on H.R. 2811

Dear Congressman Tool, <--(I'll change that before sending, LOL)

I request that expert testimony be heard before H.R. 2811 goes before any sort of vote. Please note the Executive Order on Scientific Integrity which was released from the White House March 9, 2009 states:

“When scientific or technological information is considered in policy decisions, the information should be subject to well-established scientific processes, including peer review where appropriate, and each agency should appropriately and accurately reflect that information in complying with and applying relevant statutory standards.”

At this time H.R. 2811 has not had any peer review, nor has it been subjected to any well-established scientific processes. I ask that as H.R. 2811 goes to full committee today, that provisions be made for peer review and expert testimony before it is marked up.

Thank you for your consideration.
----------------------

Odd...no email update at all today from USARK. :(

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Odd...no email update at all today from USARK. :(

Was just posted....

Was just posted....

Got the email at 11:51pm CDT, thanks. Still not posted on the Reptile Nation tho'...jus sayin'. :o

Just read the email blast from USARK and all I can say is...WHEW! :)

Here's an idea, although a bit spendy.....we should mail each of these representatives a copy of Reptiles magazine along with a letter asking the representative to count up ALL the ads in the magazine. Have a tally of ALL the advertisers in Reptiles magazine that stand to lose business and revenue if a ban goes through. Also mention the "events and shows" listings and all the lost revenue hotels and restaurants would lose because of a ban. Then mention all of the private breeders that would be put out of business if a ban goes through. Mention that not only would a python ban hurt ALL of these businesses financially, but that the US government would LOSE the tax dollars generated from all that commerce.

By the way, I counted over 60 different advertisers, 25 breeders (of just pythons), and 60 reptile shows (July-September) in the September issue of Reptiles magazine. That's a LOT of potential revenue and TAXES that could be lost by this python ban.

Tell these morons that the government might LOSE a big chunk of tax revenue and we might get their attention!